The Forum of Benfleet Running Club

JBD · Joined: 15 Sep 2007 Posts: 204

Back again...good comments chaps.

Trying something different will be to start slower than I want to be going and up the pace after a set period. Like Mike says, going off fast feels like getting time in the bank - I can fool myself that somehow I'll hang on to the pace even though I've not done it in training.

Although having said that, I think I am a naturally fast starter and it doesn't necessarily seem to help me going off slower, I just get tired after a set amount of time running....although that amount is increasing.

So, anyway....let's play about with this, make it interesting....I'll go off slow and try to gradually increase pace, should mean I'm overtaking people rather than being overtaken as I go along too...plan A bounce

Got my running vest today so'I'm sure wearing that will increase motivation too.

Ernie · Joined: 26 May 2006 Posts: 184 Location: Hockley GORC

I think "Running Faster" is something most of us sometime or other aspire to.

I've always strived to run faster , even now (at my age) and have had some recent success with distances 20 miles +

These days I need a good 5 or so miles into a race just to settle and get my speed up (with a pre-race warm up) and recently did the second half of a 1/2 marathon 1-2 mins faster than the first half and that is not without pushing myself to do otherwise on the first lap.

I have found that a steady even pace throughout the race works best with maybe just putting in a little extra effort in that last mile to push yourself to your limit of endurance and hopefully to cross that line feeling totally wasted.

Then you know that you have tried your best and that is really all that counts.

When will it ever be fast enough ?

Pammie · Joined: 30 Jun 2006 Posts: 298

Oh i doubt we'll ever be pleased how fast we were, if i were ever to be in a position to run sub 7 min miles i know i would want 6 or 6:30 miles at least i guess as runners we'll never be satisfied

The beauty of doing the monthly serpie 5kms is i tried different tactics each month see what happens. Starting fast is an ok tactic for 5km but for anything longer could be a catastrophe.
_________________
I'll put something interesting here when i've thought of something, in the meantime heres some music.

JBD · Joined: 15 Sep 2007 Posts: 204

JBD · Joined: 15 Sep 2007 Posts: 204

Ok...race report. Not sure of time yet, I was hampered early doors by someone elses superior watch technology ! However pretty sure the guy at the finish was saying 47 mins.

Went off pretty slow as planned, stayed pretty slow for 2 miles and got far too comfortable at that pace I reckon. Still, between 3 and 5 miles I was going past people, but again I didn't feel I upped the pace much and it was probably a fairly even 7.45 pace. All good intentions to blast home from 5 miles but started to struggle with breath and wobbly striding !

Anyway, decent run, didn't stop nor feel like stopping, only slight negative being that I never felt at any point I was running fast, it felt slower than a training night - might just be a race perspective.

Still, quite positive, with more endurance training the confidence to run fast will come. Well done all you Benfleet runners, good turn out from us lot, well done the supporters, it was a cold day over there ! bounce

Stevie · Joined: 10 May 2006 Posts: 413 Location: Benfleet

Nine one mate, its good to finish feeling positive
Sounds like you need to do some more effort sessions, I found that i needed to do more than one a week to get my 10km race pace below 7 min mile pace. The Sat sessions are excellent and the track sessions throughout the summer will only make you faster over the shorter distances compress

JBD · Joined: 15 Sep 2007 Posts: 204

I'm sure you're right Steve - unfortunately sat sessions tend to be out since i have to look after jimmy billy most weeks, I think I'll just have to drag myself out really early and do some of our Tuesday sessions on my own if I want to see race improvement. Trying to do a regular long run early sunday too.

It'll come - slowly Smile

JBD · Joined: 15 Sep 2007 Posts: 204

Definitely need to do some more effort sessions, Essex Way knocked me out last night, trod water all the way back to the club. Still even a "bad" run was 8 minutes faster than just over 3 months ago according to my training log, so quite cool I reckon !

However, more importantly than that I feel the need to report that I have moved over to the dark side, and risking derision from the "real men wear shorts" party, I have in fact bought a pair of running tights !

Amusingly I had a debate with my good lady wife about the subject before Xmas, and clearly was wrong as the "running jogger thingies" are indeed marketed as "tights"....how embarrassing, I can now only pray that I don't get referred to as Max Wall every time I go running.

Happy days.... bounce

Mike Mason · Joined: 02 Jun 2006 Posts: 953 Location: Hockley

is this where you bought them from?

http://www.zombierunner.com/store/brands/eric_clifton_jesterwear/

Karl buys his shorts from them.....
_________________
'sometimes I am running so fast it appears that rocks and trees are standing still......' 'I may be slow, but you are ugly and I can train harder.' '90% is mental, the other half is physical'it's going to get a lot worse, before it gets worse'.

JBD · Joined: 15 Sep 2007 Posts: 204

Very fetching ! I have already suffered abuse at home for the basic ones I've bought, I hardly think I could carry those little babies off !

Are there any "bad taste" nights down the club ? Could be an idea, once a month everyone wears their most loud unco-ordinated gear, off we go proudly representing the club ?! Oh, that's most nights....ah well.... bom

JBD · Joined: 15 Sep 2007 Posts: 204

After Great Bentley, I was just reflecting on the time and realised that when I started this thread I was doing 8 minute miles for about 3 miles and 4 months later have done that (near enough) for 13 miles.

Maybe not getting faster, but stronger for longer.
Different sort of achievement than I first set out for but nonetheless in terms of feelgood factor.

Interesting....that's all..... cyclops_ani

mikemoreton · Joined: 23 Apr 2007 Posts: 543 Location: Hockley, GORC.

Thats truly commendable. Well done. Maybe a sub 3.5 hour marathon could be on the cards? Certainly a sub 4 hour.
Keep going

MM2

PS I am still around 10.5 min miling over 5 miles or so. But, its winter and cold and rainy.............

Stevie · Joined: 10 May 2006 Posts: 413 Location: Benfleet

Thats great stuff Steve, its not until you take a step back from training when you realise how much you have improved, I think we all are too tough on ourselves sometimes.

The speed work will come but you need to do the track sessions in the summer and other speed sessions, i had to do 2 - 3 speed sessions a week until I was able to run faster.

Keep going mate, your running very well thumbleft

JBD · Joined: 15 Sep 2007 Posts: 204

Cheers Steve...I'm really hoping to get some speed sessions in soon, so tricky with Jimmy, maybe he can play in the long jump pit while I'm running round ??!!

Anyway...good start to the year of the Dear, keep it going sir cheers

JBD · Joined: 15 Sep 2007 Posts: 204

Just keeping my personal public log up to date:

Essex 20 a couple of weeks ago in 2.47.29 which is 8.22 minute mile pace - very pleased. Subsequent effort sessions on the back of the confidence generated by that and Great Bentley have shown some speed improvement.

See how Ultra goes on Sunday, hope to do the full 22 in good shape. Have now entered Bungay marathon on 6 April, will be first one but if I'm honest I wish it was tomorrow, nicely up for it.

Note to self - be wary of enjoying sunday runs through uncertain terrain with Ernie & Mike Mason et al, it's only a matter of time before I get drawn into the dark world of ultra running.....must resist........

Karl C · Joined: 11 May 2006 Posts: 1690 Location: Rayleigh

It is not the unknown territory you should worry about.

We knew it was Hockley Woods so glad we kept an eye out for

angry mobs, pitchfork wielding half-breeds, in-bred weirdos, and the witchfinder general. Bring on the ducking stool and leeches.

mikey · Posted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 1:12 pm Post subject:

Ahhhh

Home ....... Sweet ...... Home

geek

Karl C · Joined: 11 May 2006 Posts: 1690 Location: Rayleigh

Another Benfleet runner gets caught in Hockley Ol'Village after even-song.

mikemoreton · Joined: 23 Apr 2007 Posts: 543 Location: Hockley, GORC.

Oi!!!

Theres is nothing wrong with Hockley Woods. I had a lovely night run with Ernie and Mike and would certainly like to do another someday.

Bring them down to my pace....

Rgds

MM2

JBD · Joined: 15 Sep 2007 Posts: 204

Feeling fatigued and consequently concerned about marathon in two weeks...very busy at work, maybe the ultra has caught up with me too. Also had to do a couple of runs by myself which i hate.

Just noting this for my own records, and maybe some of you London marathoners are feeling the same. My own thoughts are that apart from Tuesday/Thursday runs i need to do a couple of medium distance runs (15 miles and 10 miles) and eat loads of good energy food for the next two weeks and then I'll be refreshed and ready to go... bounce

mikey · Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 7:34 am Post subject:

Don’t worry … marathon training is all about running tired

The Easter weekend should have been your last hard training weekend before London

Over the next 2 weeks start to drop off the work load , 60% next weekend , 30% the weekend before London.

By doing so your body will recover, and you’re be in prime position to take advantage of the stamina you’ve built up over the last 3 months.

Be warned, you’ve got used to the heavy work load now, so easing off will feel strange.

Don’t be fooled into doing a few extra sessions, you won’t improve your fitness, but by doing extra work you will only enter the race more fatigued !!!

What’s done is done …. Ease off and enjoy the day

JBD · Joined: 15 Sep 2007 Posts: 204

Thanks Mikey

I'm doing Bungay the week before London so I'm trying to co-ordinate everything that the London marathoners are doing but to be prepared a week earlier ! Had an encouraging 14.5 miles on my own on Sunday followed by a gentle 6.4 yesterday.

Can't get to the club this week so more solo runs and a last 10 miler on Sunday followed by self imposed light club sessions the Tues & Thurs before my marathon....a good plan ? Hope so !

JBD · Joined: 15 Sep 2007 Posts: 204

Bungay Marathon 6 April 2008
Weather - cold and snowy
Course - bit hilly, some trail running
Own Condition - nervous, in some part due to nagging fatigue feeling since benfleet ultra, and also not enough miles under my belt ?

Felt tired after only 8/9 miles, comes to something when you have to tell yourself there are only 17 miles to go....wheels really came off at around 16 onwards, peaking at 22/23 with leg cramps and real consideration that might be more sensible to stop, however knew I had to finish and latched on to slower half marathoners for a tow home at decent pace, came home relatively strong.

Mile splits

The Good (ish)

7.45, 7.51, 7.55, 7.53, 8.12, 8.10, 8.18, 8.24, 8.27, 8.44, 8.44

The Bad (it's all relative)

9.16, 9.13 (13 mile time 1.48.50), 9.06, 9.22, 10.05, 9.55, 9.58

The Ugly (pain !)

10.21, 11.31, 11.41, 13.51, 13.55, 11.25, 9.53, 9.56 (miles 14-26 2.24 ish) + 3.28 (0.4 miles)

Aftermath:

Pain in calves unbelievable - agony doesn't quite describe it for me, no release from stabbing pain, could barely move and couldn't find any position to relieve it - 30 mins before it eased enough to walk out of changing room !

Conclusion:

Easy to analyse it and it looks like I started too fast, very cold and quite hilly so that saps your strength a bit, probably did a marathon a bit sooner than I should have as legs will no doubt toughen up in time. 26.2 miles is not 20 miles - in that by that stage it's potentially another hour running and psychologically longer, not to be under-estimated and I think having done the Essex 20 and ultra, I probably did.

On the positive side, I have done a marathon !!!
I overcame the pain and got home in a time that is no disgrace.
I will do another marathon and do it quicker.
Hurrah cheers

mikey · Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 9:45 am Post subject:

Hi JBD

Can’t quite work out your actual finish time !

Would add up all the splits ….. But thought you might know off the top of your head

& yes you did go off to fast

But until you do your first marathon you never really know what to fast is.
Its all part of the learning curve, next time you can start slightly slower and try to run at an even pace for the full distance. Easier said than done, but you should end up with a faster time.

JBD · Joined: 15 Sep 2007 Posts: 204

Good point !
Finish time was 4 hrs 13 mins 17 secs.
135th out of 197.

Yup, lot of value in experience, still early days for me I suppose, more positives than negatives out of this marathon though, and that's what you want.... bounce

mikey · Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 10:39 am Post subject:

Yeap 4:13 on a cold and hilly course is a good first marathon time

There’s defiantly a lot more speed in your marathon tank, so you’ve got something to work towards for the marathons to come.

The main thing is you’ve done the distance and set a target

Next time round you’re be mentally stronger, and probably fitter too

Roll on the next one

Pammie · Joined: 30 Jun 2006 Posts: 298

JBD
Firstly congrats on your marathon, something to be proud of, and still a decent enough time

Yes you did start too quickly but its all a learning curve and you will have learned something for next time, good to hear some positivity in that there will be a next time
_________________
I'll put something interesting here when i've thought of something, in the meantime heres some music.

Mike Mason · Joined: 02 Jun 2006 Posts: 953 Location: Hockley

and to add to Mikey's last point.....'next time you won't have the Albatross with you.....' colors

_________________
'sometimes I am running so fast it appears that rocks and trees are standing still......' 'I may be slow, but you are ugly and I can train harder.' '90% is mental, the other half is physical'it's going to get a lot worse, before it gets worse'.

JBD · Joined: 15 Sep 2007 Posts: 204

Cheers Mikey & Pammie.

Mike, I wont hear a word said against Ernie the Albatross, even if he admits himself that he's a jinx !

Glad I'm off work today...just had a lovely sleep but I'm still sleepy ! cyclops_ani

mArKw · Joined: 15 May 2006 Posts: 255 Location: Benfleet

Well done on your first marathon, Steve. It takes a while to learn how you run a marathon well and you've made a good start. Maybe next time you'll be ahead of that albatross!!! cheers

How did your post race run go this afternoon? You seemed to be jogging OK.

The caring club has spies everywhere!!

Mark
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The hills are alive........

JBD · Joined: 15 Sep 2007 Posts: 204

Ha ha....!

I shuffled along for a very slow mile, just in an attempt to get the aching muscles going....didn't really work, still stiff as a board !
cheers

JBD · Joined: 15 Sep 2007 Posts: 204

Update....attempting speed training over the spring summer.

Did my old regular 3.3 mile circuit today in 23.30 which averages out at 7.07 miling......so, some 7 months or so after starting this thread, I'm halfway towards the goal, give or take....first time i did this circuit i did it in around 32 mins, and my previous best was around 25 mins....

Now, how do i get it down to 6.30 by the end of the summer ??
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Beware of the Albatross

mikemoreton · Joined: 23 Apr 2007 Posts: 543 Location: Hockley, GORC.

JBD:

Buy a bike/car/helicopter?

MM2

JBD · Joined: 15 Sep 2007 Posts: 204

Dark Lane 5k

21.28 - works out to 6.55 miling.

Now, I reckon that's a bit short to claim half way to 6 minute miling but hell, lies damn lies and statistics....

All good though... cheers

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Beware of the Albatross